I need some help. I am hoping to soon aquire a motorcycle. Now since I
am new I wanted to ask you guys for some newbie suggestions like
things I should do or correct or etc. So heres my plan:

1. Take a MSF course.
2. Get a Ninja 250 or 500 along with gear.
3. And start practicing.

Is that a good start? Also if you have good gear ideas please let me
know I would be happy to get as many as I could. I would hopfully want
it to be black due to the fact is matchs to everyting and the scraps
wont be seen as bad if I crash.

Thanks a lot, Eugene.

On Nov 7, 9:58 am, Eugene Z <Ukie2...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I need some help. I am hoping to soon aquire a motorcycle. Now since I
> am new I wanted to ask you guys for some newbie suggestions like
> things I should do or correct or etc. So heres my plan:
>
> 1. Take a MSF course.
> 2. Get a Ninja 250 or 500 along with gear.
> 3. And start practicing.
>
> Is that a good start? Also if you have good gear ideas please let me
> know I would be happy to get as many as I could. I would hopfully want
> it to be black due to the fact is matchs to everyting and the scraps
> wont be seen as bad if I crash.

Basically a good plan, except the idea of wearing all black. In your
MSF class, they'll talk about conspicuity and about how easy it is for
other motorists to overlook motorcyclists in traffic. A good way to
combat some of that lack of visibility is to make yourself more
sonspicuous with brightly colored and (for night time riding)
retroreflective gear.

Good luck, welcome to Reeky (and good luck with that!), and let us
know how your class goes!

Tim

On Nov 7, 9:58 am, Eugene Z <Ukie2...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I need some help.
> Is that a good start? Also if you have good gear ideas please let me
> know I would be happy to get as many as I could. I would hopfully want
> it to be black due to the fact is matchs to everyting and the scraps
> wont be seen as bad if I crash.
>
> Thanks a lot, Eugene.

Wrong reasoning in picking gear. However, if matching is crucial,
consider getting a different color or color scheme.

Most times, white can be substituted for black (ex. helmets) without
much aesthetic impact.

On a ninja, as you mentioned, you could take the peacock approach and
get wild colors that match your ride - bright green, yellow, red, etc.
You don't need to wear neon yellow with stupid reflective tape, you
can look badass and still be seen.

Grats in advance on waiting until after you take the course to start
practicing. Buy the bike *after* the course so you aren't tempted and
don't cause yourself any damage.

-c
WARNING: The above post may contain opinion.

I think Eugene has all the right ideas.

As for black gear, I don't think it's any less visible in daylight. I
doubt there are any statistics to support either side. I think the
least we can say is there's a dozen other safety factors that are more
important.

At night I wear a reflective bib thing, like a crossing guard.

On Nov 7, 9:08 am, "tomor...@erols.com" <tomor...@erols.com> wrote:
> On Nov 7, 9:58 am, Eugene Z <Ukie2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I need some help. I am hoping to soon aquire a motorcycle. Now since I
> > am new I wanted to ask you guys for some newbie suggestions like
> > things I should do or correct or etc. So heres my plan:
>
> > 1. Take a MSF course.
> > 2. Get a Ninja 250 or 500 along with gear.
> > 3. And start practicing.
>
> > Is that a good start? Also if you have good gear ideas please let me
> > know I would be happy to get as many as I could. I would hopfully want
> > it to be black due to the fact is matchs to everyting and the scraps
> > wont be seen as bad if I crash.
>
> Basically a good plan, except the idea of wearing all black. In your
> MSF class, they'll talk about conspicuity and about how easy it is for
> other motorists to overlook motorcyclists in traffic. A good way to
> combat some of that lack of visibility is to make yourself more
> sonspicuous with brightly colored and (for night time riding)
> retroreflective gear.
>
> Good luck, welcome to Reeky (and good luck with that!), and let us
> know how your class goes!
>
> Tim

Tim's correct about your plan being good, and about getting
conspicuous gear.

However, I'm a bit astounded that you didn't get at least *some* sort
of lambasting. After all, this is rec.moto.

--
DOD #4747
2007 Ducati 1098
2003 Kawasaki ZZR1200
1999 Kawasaki KLR650

On Nov 7, 9:58 am, Eugene Z <Ukie2...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Is that a good start?

As others have already chimed in, sounds good. The only possible flaw
is that you may want to postpone your bike selection until after the
course. Depending on a lot of factors, neither the 250 or the 500 may
be right for you. But you're doing things in the right order to find
out.

"Eugene Z" <Ukie2340@gmail.com> wrote

Advise here is easy; good advise however................;-)

> 2. Get a Ninja 250 or 500 along with gear.

Actually these are quite different bikes, despite the similar name.
Take the course. Get your license.
Then don't buy anything without getting a test ride.
Get a bike that FITS YOU.
Size, seat height, position of the controls, weight and power should all
match your current "condition".
Look and sound come WAY down on the list (or at least they should).

Eugene Z wrote:
> I would hopfully want
> it to be black due to the fact is matchs to everyting and the scraps
> wont be seen as bad if I crash.

Make sure you're wearing the appropriate underwear for
an Emergency Ward. It can be very embarrassing for a male
hermaphrodite to be seen in frilly lace undies.

Sean_Q_

On Nov 7, 7:58 am, Eugene Z <Ukie2...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I need some help. I am hoping to soon aquire a motorcycle. Now since I
> am new I wanted to ask you guys for some newbie suggestions like
> things I should do or correct or etc. So heres my plan:
>
> 1. Take a MSF course.
> 2. Get a Ninja 250 or 500 along with gear.
> 3. And start practicing.
>
> Is that a good start? Also if you have good gear ideas please let me
> know I would be happy to get as many as I could. I would hopfully want
> it to be black due to the fact is matchs to everyting and the scraps
> wont be seen as bad if I crash.
>
> Thanks a lot, Eugene.

Good Start. But be sure and get aftermarket pipes, after all loud
pipes save lives!

</sarcasm>

"Eugene Z" <Ukie2340@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1194447508.756726.256370@22g2000hsm.googlegro ups.com...
>I need some help. I am hoping to soon aquire a motorcycle. Now since I
> am new I wanted to ask you guys for some newbie suggestions like
> things I should do or correct or etc. So heres my plan:
>
> 1. Take a MSF course.
> 2. Get a Ninja 250 or 500 along with gear.
> 3. And start practicing.
>
> Is that a good start? Also if you have good gear ideas please let me
> know I would be happy to get as many as I could. I would hopfully want
> it to be black due to the fact is matchs to everyting and the scraps
> wont be seen as bad if I crash.
>
> Thanks a lot, Eugene.
>

Very good points have been made by everyone. I suggest the Ninja 500. Mine
is five years old and going strong. I have put 45,000 miles on mine and I
am still not bored with it. Overall, I think that it is a great starter
bike. That being said, get a bike that YOU like. .

Andrew.

On Nov 7, 6:58 am, Eugene Z <Ukie2...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I need some help. I am hoping to soon aquire a motorcycle. Now since I
> am new I wanted to ask you guys for some newbie suggestions like
> things I should do or correct or etc. So heres my plan:
>
> 1. Take a MSF course.
> 2. Get a Ninja 250 or 500 along with gear.
> 3. And start practicing.
>
> Is that a good start? Also if you have good gear ideas please let me
> know I would be happy to get as many as I could. I would hopfully want
> it to be black due to the fact is matchs to everyting and the scraps
> wont be seen as bad if I crash.

I like black because any other color shows stains and
road grime badly, especially if you ride in wet weather.

If you go with black, it should have lots of reflective panels
for visibility. A highly visible helmet, conspicuity vest and/or
maybe some other reflective decals on the bike would be
good too.

I suggest you complete the course before making up your
mind on the bike. You may change your mind about what
you want as a result of the course.

Going into winter, you need to figure out what you'll do
about rain. Riding in rain can be a little dicey. Riding wet
in the rain can chill you quickly and dangerously. Consider
packing a rainsuit and be careful to read weather reports.

On Wed, 07 Nov 2007 11:26:11 -0800, Rob Kleinschmidt
<Rkleinsch1216128@aol.com> wrote:

>On Nov 7, 6:58 am, Eugene Z <Ukie2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> I need some help. I am hoping to soon aquire a motorcycle. Now since I
>> am new I wanted to ask you guys for some newbie suggestions like
>> things I should do or correct or etc. So heres my plan:
>>
>> 1. Take a MSF course.
>> 2. Get a Ninja 250 or 500 along with gear.
>> 3. And start practicing.

My ignorant thought- at first, to a new rider, ANY bike is
going to feel BIG. After a month or two, especially at highway
speeds, it starts feeling a lot smaller. The second feeling stays
with you, the first does not. So, don't let 'Damn, the 500 feels
HUGE and heavy and awkward compared to the 250' be your deciding
factor - after a month or so, you'll realize you don't want to be
taking that 250 out on the freeway in traffic and wind, and wishing
you had the 500.


>>
>> Is that a good start? Also if you have good gear ideas please let me
>> know I would be happy to get as many as I could. I would hopfully want
>> it to be black due to the fact is matchs to everyting and the scraps
>> wont be seen as bad if I crash.
>
>I like black because any other color shows stains and
>road grime badly, especially if you ride in wet weather.
>
>If you go with black, it should have lots of reflective panels
>for visibility. A highly visible helmet, conspicuity vest and/or
>maybe some other reflective decals on the bike would be
>good too.
>
>I suggest you complete the course before making up your
>mind on the bike. You may change your mind about what
>you want as a result of the course.
>
>Going into winter, you need to figure out what you'll do
>about rain. Riding in rain can be a little dicey. Riding wet
>in the rain can chill you quickly and dangerously. Consider
>packing a rainsuit and be careful to read weather reports.

--
Click here every day to feed an animal that needs you today !!!
http://www.theanimalrescuesite.com/

Paul ( pjm @ pobox . com ) - remove spaces to email me
'Some days, it's just not worth chewing through the restraints.'
'With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine.'
HVAC/R program for Palm PDA's
Free demo now available online http://pmilligan.net/palm/

On Wed, 07 Nov 2007 16:35:26 -0000, c <smalltalkingchicken@gmail.com>
wrote:

>You don't need to wear neon yellow with stupid reflective tape,

If you've ever seen reflective tape lit up on a dark road, you know it
isn't stupid.

--
Turby the Turbosurfer

On Nov 7, 12:18 pm, timeOday <timeOday-UNS...@theknack.net> wrote:
> I think Eugene has all the right ideas.
>
> As for black gear, I don't think it's any less visible in daylight.

Just do an experiment like I did. Wear black and gray and blue riding
gear for a year, then wear a brightly colored UPPER body garment
(jacket or the main part of a coverall-style suit) and a "safety
orange" full face, solid colored helmet for a year. RIde every day in
congested, frantic, commuter traffic.

Note the number of close calls because you weren't seen, note the
number of times you have to take action to AVOID someone who doesn't
see you, and note how many different people who know you come up to
you and ask you "Were you riding at such and such a place at such and
such a time? Because I think I saw you..."

I think - based on my experience and that of other experienced riders
- that you will note a pronounced difference in the two different
scenarios.

Then again, maybe you won't!

"c" <smalltalkingchicken@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1194538122.140042.34850@z24g2000prh.googlegro ups.com...
> On Nov 8, 3:36 am, Turby <turbosur...@beach.comber> wrote:
>
> That tape on saddlebags i'm sure is helpful and i doubt makes an
> aesthetic difference (other than improving visibility). Tape on
> something you wear = ghetto. And that's my opinion.
>
> I also tend to put more stock in the theory that it's safer to be
> invisible and never expect to be seen than to try the peacock route.
> In the 782 miles i've ridden in my life (in the US), that seems the
> way to go. I won't argue anyone with more miles.

Oh geeze.

For starters why are you bothering to post this drivel if you won't
even stick up for it when someone with more experience comes along
and says your wrong.

Non-reflective clothing is not as good as reflective clothing on a
motorcycle at night. Simple as that. There's been numerous studies of
vehicle lighting and the more lights the better. That's why they went
to center mounted high stop lights.

I won't argue that tape, reflective or not, looks ghetto on clothing.
My own riding gear is black leather without reflective material. However,
where I live just about all of the time that I ride at night I am riding
with
a rainsuit on, rain or not, primariarly as a wind shield, and it is a MC
rainsuit and has reflective material.

But it's wrong to fault the rider who has no money for better clothing
and reflective tape is the best he can do for night riding.

> People never turn
> their head when they switch lanes. People never even think about how
> fast a bike may be going when they pull out in front of it in an
> intersection. I write everyone off. Of course if i stop on the
> shoulder, maybe a bright yellow vest would be handy...
>

If you are ever in an accident at night, wearing completely non-reflective
clothing, it might mean the difference between the cop ticketing the other
driver or not. The excuse "I didn't see him" is a lot more believable
coming
from the cage driver if your not lit up.

Ted

On 8 Nov 2007 11:21:21 -0800, c <smalltalkingchicken@gmail.com> wrote:

>I also tend to put more stock in the theory that it's safer to be
>invisible and never expect to be seen than to try the peacock route.

That only works if you are aware of the dangers around you and can
avoid them. What happens when you meet another person who also
believes in invisibility?

--
Turby the Turbosurfer

c wrote:
> On Nov 8, 3:36 am, Turby <turbosur...@beach.comber> wrote:
>>>>> You don't need to wear neon yellow with stupid reflective tape,
>>
>>>> If you've ever seen reflective tape lit up on a dark road, you
>>>> know it isn't stupid.
>>
>>> Of course it has its uses. It doesn't sound safe to me to have
>>> tape
>>> be the thing that makes a rider seen - but i have no right to
>>> judge. My jacket is all black, but it has reflective bars sewn in.
>>> It's the same thing it's just made to be part of the design. I
>>> thought it was silly to wear something rube-goldberg'd.
>>
>> "Doesn't sound safe"??? Who cares what does the trick, as long as
>> people see you? I don't care if it's the color of my socks, as long
>> as _something_ gets their attention.
>>
>
> I meant as the only thing. As in, picking a riding jacket because it
> keeps you warm and then throwing on tape to make the jacket visible.
> That = lame.

Well let's see, the guy is warm and visible. That's a lot less lame
than being cold and invisible. And an infinitely lot less lame than
he'd be if he got hit by a cager who didn't see him because he was
invisible.

>> Both Aerostich and Motoport put tape across the back of their
>> jackets.
>> Take a look here. Go to slide 2 of the "detailed images"
>> link.http://www.aerostich.com/catalog/US/...Jacket-p-16376....
>> orhttp://tinyurl.com/246ot8
>> It's amazing how much that tape stands out when a car's headlights
>> shine on it. When so many poseurs care more about how they look,
>> and
>> replace the stock tail lights with dinky little bulbs, a strip like
>> that can shine far brighter than tail lights.
>>
>
> That's not tape, that's reflective material that's part of the
> jacket.
> I'm talking about a roll of tape, like duct tape, that's reflective
> on
> the back. And all i'm saying is i think it looks stupid. If you
> think
> it's awesome, more power to you. What you linked is a jacket with
> reflective strips as part of the design. I have the same situation,
> just a very different jacket.

I'd rather look stupid than act stupid.

>> A few years ago, the ST1100 list had a thread on stick-on tape. It
>> was
>> an adhesive transparent sheet that you cut up, peeled off the
>> backing
>> and put on your saddlebags or rear fender. I don't remember the
>> particulars, I think it was made by 3M. The stuff was amazing. In
>> daylight, you couldn't tell it was there, but when a light shined
>> on
>> it at night, it really was bright.
>
> That tape on saddlebags i'm sure is helpful and i doubt makes an
> aesthetic difference (other than improving visibility). Tape on
> something you wear = ghetto. And that's my opinion.

So it's ghetto, so what? You seem to be putting a great deal of store
by style, and little by substance.

Yeah, in an ideal world one has it all. Everybody who rides isn't
rich you know--for some folks the bike is cheap transportation and
tossing a perfectly good jacket because it's not reflective isn't in
the budget, but maybe a roll of reflective tape is.

> I also tend to put more stock in the theory that it's safer to be
> invisible and never expect to be seen than to try the peacock route.

How about the theory that it's safer to be highly visible and never
expect to be seen?

> In the 782 miles i've ridden in my life (in the US), that seems the
> way to go.

> When you've got 78,200 then get back to us.

> I won't argue anyone with more miles.

Which is most of the people here.

> People never turn
> their head when they switch lanes. People never even think about how
> fast a bike may be going when they pull out in front of it in an
> intersection. I write everyone off.

Good policy. That doesn't mean that the one that you managed to miss
and who would have seen you if you had a little bit more conspicuity
isn't going to get you.

> Of course if i stop on the
> shoulder, maybe a bright yellow vest would be handy...

--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

On Nov 9, 7:44 am, "J. Clarke" <jclarke.use...@cox.net> wrote:
> c wrote:
> > On Nov 8, 3:36 am, Turby <turbosur...@beach.comber> wrote:
> >>>>> You don't need to wear neon yellow with stupid reflective tape,
>
> >>>> If you've ever seen reflective tape lit up on a dark road, you
> >>>> know it isn't stupid.
>
> >>> Of course it has its uses. It doesn't sound safe to me to have
> >>> tape
> >>> be the thing that makes a rider seen - but i have no right to
> >>> judge. My jacket is all black, but it has reflective bars sewn in.
> >>> It's the same thing it's just made to be part of the design. I
> >>> thought it was silly to wear something rube-goldberg'd.
>
> >> "Doesn't sound safe"??? Who cares what does the trick, as long as
> >> people see you? I don't care if it's the color of my socks, as long
> >> as _something_ gets their attention.
>
> > I meant as the only thing. As in, picking a riding jacket because it
> > keeps you warm and then throwing on tape to make the jacket visible.
> > That = lame.
>
> Well let's see, the guy is warm and visible. That's a lot less lame
> than being cold and invisible. And an infinitely lot less lame than
> he'd be if he got hit by a cager who didn't see him because he was
> invisible.
>
>
>
> >> Both Aerostich and Motoport put tape across the back of their
> >> jackets.
> >> Take a look here. Go to slide 2 of the "detailed images"
> >> link.http://www.aerostich.com/catalog/US/...Jacket-p-16376....
> >> orhttp://tinyurl.com/246ot8
> >> It's amazing how much that tape stands out when a car's headlights
> >> shine on it. When so many poseurs care more about how they look,
> >> and
> >> replace the stock tail lights with dinky little bulbs, a strip like
> >> that can shine far brighter than tail lights.
>
> > That's not tape, that's reflective material that's part of the
> > jacket.
> > I'm talking about a roll of tape, like duct tape, that's reflective
> > on
> > the back. And all i'm saying is i think it looks stupid. If you
> > think
> > it's awesome, more power to you. What you linked is a jacket with
> > reflective strips as part of the design. I have the same situation,
> > just a very different jacket.
>
> I'd rather look stupid than act stupid.
>
> >> A few years ago, the ST1100 list had a thread on stick-on tape. It
> >> was
> >> an adhesive transparent sheet that you cut up, peeled off the
> >> backing
> >> and put on your saddlebags or rear fender. I don't remember the
> >> particulars, I think it was made by 3M. The stuff was amazing. In
> >> daylight, you couldn't tell it was there, but when a light shined
> >> on
> >> it at night, it really was bright.
>
> > That tape on saddlebags i'm sure is helpful and i doubt makes an
> > aesthetic difference (other than improving visibility). Tape on
> > something you wear = ghetto. And that's my opinion.
>
> So it's ghetto, so what? You seem to be putting a great deal of store
> by style, and little by substance.
>
> Yeah, in an ideal world one has it all. Everybody who rides isn't
> rich you know--for some folks the bike is cheap transportation and
> tossing a perfectly good jacket because it's not reflective isn't in
> the budget, but maybe a roll of reflective tape is.
>
> > I also tend to put more stock in the theory that it's safer to be
> > invisible and never expect to be seen than to try the peacock route.
>
> How about the theory that it's safer to be highly visible and never
> expect to be seen?
>
> > In the 782 miles i've ridden in my life (in the US), that seems the
> > way to go.
> > When you've got 78,200 then get back to us.
> > I won't argue anyone with more miles.
>
> Which is most of the people here.
>
> > People never turn
> > their head when they switch lanes. People never even think about how
> > fast a bike may be going when they pull out in front of it in an
> > intersection. I write everyone off.
>
> Good policy. That doesn't mean that the one that you managed to miss
> and who would have seen you if you had a little bit more conspicuity
> isn't going to get you.
>
> > Of course if i stop on the
> > shoulder, maybe a bright yellow vest would be handy...
>
> --
> --
> --John
> to email, dial "usenet" and validate
> (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)


This is argumentative bullshit (and the other post[s] above).

Wearing something designed for a purpose beats wearing something
designed for a different purpose and then haphazardly fitted to that
purpose. If cost is the reason someone's doing it the way i described
as looking stupid, fine. But that wasn't the point in the thread - no
where did the OP say "i can't afford a jacket with reflective
material, only the $10 for reflective tape to stick all over my north
face jacket."

Respond if you're wearing a jacket not designed for motorcycle riding
and wearing it with reflective tape on it.

Shut up if you're wearing a jacket designed for visibility.

Seriously.

On Nov 7, 2:41 pm, Turby <turbosur...@beach.comber> wrote:
> On Wed, 07 Nov 2007 16:35:26 -0000, c <smalltalkingchic...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >You don't need to wear neon yellow with stupid reflective tape,
>
> If you've ever seen reflective tape lit up on a dark road, you know it
> isn't stupid.
>
> --
> Turby the Turbosurfer


Of course it has its uses. It doesn't sound safe to me to have tape be
the thing that makes a rider seen - but i have no right to judge. My
jacket is all black, but it has reflective bars sewn in. It's the same
thing it's just made to be part of the design. I thought it was silly
to wear something rube-goldberg'd.

Incidentally, i learned the hard way that a motorcycle jacket should
be 1-2 sizes larger than a normal jacket to account for layers.

<.p.jm@see_my_sig_for_address.com> wrote in message
news:0554j3h56a345dkih9h689doc1qtblmsmp@4ax.com...
>
> My ignorant thought- at first, to a new rider, ANY bike is

..p and an ignorant thought? How redundant.

> going to feel BIG. After a month or two, especially at highway
> speeds, it starts feeling a lot smaller. The second feeling stays
> with you, the first does not. So, don't let 'Damn, the 500 feels
> HUGE and heavy and awkward compared to the 250' be your deciding
> factor - after a month or so, you'll realize you don't want to be
> taking that 250 out on the freeway in traffic and wind, and wishing
> you had the 500.
>
>

How would you know? The Ninja 250 is one kick ass bike. Undoubtably the
best 250 in the U.S. market.

Get back to us when you actually have real experience to base your opinion.

c wrote:

> Of course it has its uses. It doesn't sound safe to me to have tape be
> the thing that makes a rider seen

http://www.conspicuityinc.com/

I have one of the lime yellow ones as shown on the main page, with an
additional same material club logo in the center rear. It is quite
visible at any time, day or night.

--
-bts
-Motorcycles defy gravity; cars just suck

On Wed, 07 Nov 2007 06:58:28 -0800, Eugene Z <Ukie2340@gmail.com>
wrote:

>I need some help. I am hoping to soon aquire a motorcycle. Now since I
>am new I wanted to ask you guys for some newbie suggestions like
>things I should do or correct or etc. So heres my plan:
>
>1. Take a MSF course.
>2. Get a Ninja 250 or 500 along with gear.
>3. And start practicing.
>
>Is that a good start? Also if you have good gear ideas please let me
>know I would be happy to get as many as I could. I would hopfully want
>it to be black due to the fact is matchs to everyting and the scraps
>wont be seen as bad if I crash.

Don't worry about the looks so much. Scuff marks are just as obvious
on black as on any other color.

The most important thing about gear is that it should fit comfortably.
If it doesn't you'll find you use it less and less, until one day you
aren't using it and need it.

Al Moore
DoD 734

On Wed, 07 Nov 2007 23:39:57 -0000, c <smalltalkingchicken@gmail.com>
wrote:

>On Nov 7, 2:41 pm, Turby <turbosur...@beach.comber> wrote:
>> On Wed, 07 Nov 2007 16:35:26 -0000, c <smalltalkingchic...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >You don't need to wear neon yellow with stupid reflective tape,
>>
>> If you've ever seen reflective tape lit up on a dark road, you know it
>> isn't stupid.
>
>Of course it has its uses. It doesn't sound safe to me to have tape be
>the thing that makes a rider seen - but i have no right to judge. My
>jacket is all black, but it has reflective bars sewn in. It's the same
>thing it's just made to be part of the design. I thought it was silly
>to wear something rube-goldberg'd.

"Doesn't sound safe"??? Who cares what does the trick, as long as
people see you? I don't care if it's the color of my socks, as long as
_something_ gets their attention.

Both Aerostich and Motoport put tape across the back of their jackets.
Take a look here. Go to slide 2 of the "detailed images" link.
http://www.aerostich.com/catalog/US/...t-p-16376.html
or
http://tinyurl.com/246ot8
It's amazing how much that tape stands out when a car's headlights
shine on it. When so many poseurs care more about how they look, and
replace the stock tail lights with dinky little bulbs, a strip like
that can shine far brighter than tail lights.

A few years ago, the ST1100 list had a thread on stick-on tape. It was
an adhesive transparent sheet that you cut up, peeled off the backing
and put on your saddlebags or rear fender. I don't remember the
particulars, I think it was made by 3M. The stuff was amazing. In
daylight, you couldn't tell it was there, but when a light shined on
it at night, it really was bright.

>Incidentally, i learned the hard way that a motorcycle jacket should
>be 1-2 sizes larger than a normal jacket to account for layers.

Fer shur.

--
Turby the Turbosurfer

On Nov 8, 3:36 am, Turby <turbosur...@beach.comber> wrote:
> >> >You don't need to wear neon yellow with stupid reflective tape,
>
> >> If you've ever seen reflective tape lit up on a dark road, you know it
> >> isn't stupid.
>
> >Of course it has its uses. It doesn't sound safe to me to have tape be
> >the thing that makes a rider seen - but i have no right to judge. My
> >jacket is all black, but it has reflective bars sewn in. It's the same
> >thing it's just made to be part of the design. I thought it was silly
> >to wear something rube-goldberg'd.
>
> "Doesn't sound safe"??? Who cares what does the trick, as long as
> people see you? I don't care if it's the color of my socks, as long as
> _something_ gets their attention.
>

I meant as the only thing. As in, picking a riding jacket because it
keeps you warm and then throwing on tape to make the jacket visible.
That = lame.

> Both Aerostich and Motoport put tape across the back of their jackets.
> Take a look here. Go to slide 2 of the "detailed images" link.http://www.aerostich.com/catalog/US/...Jacket-p-16376....
> orhttp://tinyurl.com/246ot8
> It's amazing how much that tape stands out when a car's headlights
> shine on it. When so many poseurs care more about how they look, and
> replace the stock tail lights with dinky little bulbs, a strip like
> that can shine far brighter than tail lights.
>

That's not tape, that's reflective material that's part of the jacket.
I'm talking about a roll of tape, like duct tape, that's reflective on
the back. And all i'm saying is i think it looks stupid. If you think
it's awesome, more power to you. What you linked is a jacket with
reflective strips as part of the design. I have the same situation,
just a very different jacket.


> A few years ago, the ST1100 list had a thread on stick-on tape. It was
> an adhesive transparent sheet that you cut up, peeled off the backing
> and put on your saddlebags or rear fender. I don't remember the
> particulars, I think it was made by 3M. The stuff was amazing. In
> daylight, you couldn't tell it was there, but when a light shined on
> it at night, it really was bright.

That tape on saddlebags i'm sure is helpful and i doubt makes an
aesthetic difference (other than improving visibility). Tape on
something you wear = ghetto. And that's my opinion.

I also tend to put more stock in the theory that it's safer to be
invisible and never expect to be seen than to try the peacock route.
In the 782 miles i've ridden in my life (in the US), that seems the
way to go. I won't argue anyone with more miles. People never turn
their head when they switch lanes. People never even think about how
fast a bike may be going when they pull out in front of it in an
intersection. I write everyone off. Of course if i stop on the
shoulder, maybe a bright yellow vest would be handy...

"c" <smalltalkingchicken@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1194538122.140042.34850@z24g2000prh.googlegro ups.com...
> On Nov 8, 3:36 am, Turby <turbosur...@beach.comber> wrote:
>
> That tape on saddlebags i'm sure is helpful and i doubt makes an
> aesthetic difference (other than improving visibility). Tape on
> something you wear = ghetto. And that's my opinion.
>
> I also tend to put more stock in the theory that it's safer to be
> invisible and never expect to be seen than to try the peacock route.
> In the 782 miles i've ridden in my life (in the US), that seems the
> way to go. I won't argue anyone with more miles.

Oh geeze.

For starters why are you bothering to post this drivel if you won't
even stick up for it when someone with more experience comes along
and says your wrong.

Non-reflective clothing is not as good as reflective clothing on a
motorcycle at night. Simple as that. There's been numerous studies of
vehicle lighting and the more lights the better. That's why they went
to center mounted high stop lights.

I won't argue that tape, reflective or not, looks ghetto on clothing.
My own riding gear is black leather without reflective material. However,
where I live just about all of the time that I ride at night I am riding
with
a rainsuit on, rain or not, primariarly as a wind shield, and it is a MC
rainsuit and has reflective material.

But it's wrong to fault the rider who has no money for better clothing
and reflective tape is the best he can do for night riding.

> People never turn
> their head when they switch lanes. People never even think about how
> fast a bike may be going when they pull out in front of it in an
> intersection. I write everyone off. Of course if i stop on the
> shoulder, maybe a bright yellow vest would be handy...
>

If you are ever in an accident at night, wearing completely non-reflective
clothing, it might mean the difference between the cop ticketing the other
driver or not. The excuse "I didn't see him" is a lot more believable
coming
from the cage driver if your not lit up.

Ted

On 8 Nov 2007 11:21:21 -0800, c <smalltalkingchicken@gmail.com> wrote:

>I also tend to put more stock in the theory that it's safer to be
>invisible and never expect to be seen than to try the peacock route.

That only works if you are aware of the dangers around you and can
avoid them. What happens when you meet another person who also
believes in invisibility?

--
Turby the Turbosurfer

c wrote:
> On Nov 8, 3:36 am, Turby <turbosur...@beach.comber> wrote:
>>>>> You don't need to wear neon yellow with stupid reflective tape,
>>
>>>> If you've ever seen reflective tape lit up on a dark road, you
>>>> know it isn't stupid.
>>
>>> Of course it has its uses. It doesn't sound safe to me to have
>>> tape
>>> be the thing that makes a rider seen - but i have no right to
>>> judge. My jacket is all black, but it has reflective bars sewn in.
>>> It's the same thing it's just made to be part of the design. I
>>> thought it was silly to wear something rube-goldberg'd.
>>
>> "Doesn't sound safe"??? Who cares what does the trick, as long as
>> people see you? I don't care if it's the color of my socks, as long
>> as _something_ gets their attention.
>>
>
> I meant as the only thing. As in, picking a riding jacket because it
> keeps you warm and then throwing on tape to make the jacket visible.
> That = lame.

Well let's see, the guy is warm and visible. That's a lot less lame
than being cold and invisible. And an infinitely lot less lame than
he'd be if he got hit by a cager who didn't see him because he was
invisible.

>> Both Aerostich and Motoport put tape across the back of their
>> jackets.
>> Take a look here. Go to slide 2 of the "detailed images"
>> link.http://www.aerostich.com/catalog/US/...Jacket-p-16376....
>> orhttp://tinyurl.com/246ot8
>> It's amazing how much that tape stands out when a car's headlights
>> shine on it. When so many poseurs care more about how they look,
>> and
>> replace the stock tail lights with dinky little bulbs, a strip like
>> that can shine far brighter than tail lights.
>>
>
> That's not tape, that's reflective material that's part of the
> jacket.
> I'm talking about a roll of tape, like duct tape, that's reflective
> on
> the back. And all i'm saying is i think it looks stupid. If you
> think
> it's awesome, more power to you. What you linked is a jacket with
> reflective strips as part of the design. I have the same situation,
> just a very different jacket.

I'd rather look stupid than act stupid.

>> A few years ago, the ST1100 list had a thread on stick-on tape. It
>> was
>> an adhesive transparent sheet that you cut up, peeled off the
>> backing
>> and put on your saddlebags or rear fender. I don't remember the
>> particulars, I think it was made by 3M. The stuff was amazing. In
>> daylight, you couldn't tell it was there, but when a light shined
>> on
>> it at night, it really was bright.
>
> That tape on saddlebags i'm sure is helpful and i doubt makes an
> aesthetic difference (other than improving visibility). Tape on
> something you wear = ghetto. And that's my opinion.

So it's ghetto, so what? You seem to be putting a great deal of store
by style, and little by substance.

Yeah, in an ideal world one has it all. Everybody who rides isn't
rich you know--for some folks the bike is cheap transportation and
tossing a perfectly good jacket because it's not reflective isn't in
the budget, but maybe a roll of reflective tape is.

> I also tend to put more stock in the theory that it's safer to be
> invisible and never expect to be seen than to try the peacock route.

How about the theory that it's safer to be highly visible and never
expect to be seen?

> In the 782 miles i've ridden in my life (in the US), that seems the
> way to go.

> When you've got 78,200 then get back to us.

> I won't argue anyone with more miles.

Which is most of the people here.

> People never turn
> their head when they switch lanes. People never even think about how
> fast a bike may be going when they pull out in front of it in an
> intersection. I write everyone off.

Good policy. That doesn't mean that the one that you managed to miss
and who would have seen you if you had a little bit more conspicuity
isn't going to get you.

> Of course if i stop on the
> shoulder, maybe a bright yellow vest would be handy...

--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

On Nov 9, 7:44 am, "J. Clarke" <jclarke.use...@cox.net> wrote:
> c wrote:
> > On Nov 8, 3:36 am, Turby <turbosur...@beach.comber> wrote:
> >>>>> You don't need to wear neon yellow with stupid reflective tape,
>
> >>>> If you've ever seen reflective tape lit up on a dark road, you
> >>>> know it isn't stupid.
>
> >>> Of course it has its uses. It doesn't sound safe to me to have
> >>> tape
> >>> be the thing that makes a rider seen - but i have no right to
> >>> judge. My jacket is all black, but it has reflective bars sewn in.
> >>> It's the same thing it's just made to be part of the design. I
> >>> thought it was silly to wear something rube-goldberg'd.
>
> >> "Doesn't sound safe"??? Who cares what does the trick, as long as
> >> people see you? I don't care if it's the color of my socks, as long
> >> as _something_ gets their attention.
>
> > I meant as the only thing. As in, picking a riding jacket because it
> > keeps you warm and then throwing on tape to make the jacket visible.
> > That = lame.
>
> Well let's see, the guy is warm and visible. That's a lot less lame
> than being cold and invisible. And an infinitely lot less lame than
> he'd be if he got hit by a cager who didn't see him because he was
> invisible.
>
>
>
> >> Both Aerostich and Motoport put tape across the back of their
> >> jackets.
> >> Take a look here. Go to slide 2 of the "detailed images"
> >> link.http://www.aerostich.com/catalog/US/...Jacket-p-16376....
> >> orhttp://tinyurl.com/246ot8
> >> It's amazing how much that tape stands out when a car's headlights
> >> shine on it. When so many poseurs care more about how they look,
> >> and
> >> replace the stock tail lights with dinky little bulbs, a strip like
> >> that can shine far brighter than tail lights.
>
> > That's not tape, that's reflective material that's part of the
> > jacket.
> > I'm talking about a roll of tape, like duct tape, that's reflective
> > on
> > the back. And all i'm saying is i think it looks stupid. If you
> > think
> > it's awesome, more power to you. What you linked is a jacket with
> > reflective strips as part of the design. I have the same situation,
> > just a very different jacket.
>
> I'd rather look stupid than act stupid.
>
> >> A few years ago, the ST1100 list had a thread on stick-on tape. It
> >> was
> >> an adhesive transparent sheet that you cut up, peeled off the
> >> backing
> >> and put on your saddlebags or rear fender. I don't remember the
> >> particulars, I think it was made by 3M. The stuff was amazing. In
> >> daylight, you couldn't tell it was there, but when a light shined
> >> on
> >> it at night, it really was bright.
>
> > That tape on saddlebags i'm sure is helpful and i doubt makes an
> > aesthetic difference (other than improving visibility). Tape on
> > something you wear = ghetto. And that's my opinion.
>
> So it's ghetto, so what? You seem to be putting a great deal of store
> by style, and little by substance.
>
> Yeah, in an ideal world one has it all. Everybody who rides isn't
> rich you know--for some folks the bike is cheap transportation and
> tossing a perfectly good jacket because it's not reflective isn't in
> the budget, but maybe a roll of reflective tape is.
>
> > I also tend to put more stock in the theory that it's safer to be
> > invisible and never expect to be seen than to try the peacock route.
>
> How about the theory that it's safer to be highly visible and never
> expect to be seen?
>
> > In the 782 miles i've ridden in my life (in the US), that seems the
> > way to go.
> > When you've got 78,200 then get back to us.
> > I won't argue anyone with more miles.
>
> Which is most of the people here.
>
> > People never turn
> > their head when they switch lanes. People never even think about how
> > fast a bike may be going when they pull out in front of it in an
> > intersection. I write everyone off.
>
> Good policy. That doesn't mean that the one that you managed to miss
> and who would have seen you if you had a little bit more conspicuity
> isn't going to get you.
>
> > Of course if i stop on the
> > shoulder, maybe a bright yellow vest would be handy...
>
> --
> --
> --John
> to email, dial "usenet" and validate
> (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)


This is argumentative bullshit (and the other post[s] above).

Wearing something designed for a purpose beats wearing something
designed for a different purpose and then haphazardly fitted to that
purpose. If cost is the reason someone's doing it the way i described
as looking stupid, fine. But that wasn't the point in the thread - no
where did the OP say "i can't afford a jacket with reflective
material, only the $10 for reflective tape to stick all over my north
face jacket."

Respond if you're wearing a jacket not designed for motorcycle riding
and wearing it with reflective tape on it.

Shut up if you're wearing a jacket designed for visibility.

Seriously.